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Hi everyone, I recently started to make some tracks. I had comment about my first track that it wasnt beta tested, and that I made some beginner faults. Anyways, my second track is ready and I would appreciate it if some of you wanna drive some test laps

Thnx in advance.

Beta link: http://www.freehen.raiderhosting.us/ashes/files/HiddenAirbase_Beta.zip

So far I had this lap time: 2.49.15
Sets I used: 1500 medium/soft

ps. For those who want to try my frist track you can find it at this site's track pages, its name is Cliffroad.

please replace this topic, I have just noticed there is a special area for beta's.

Sorry for the trouble

NIR_Ashes

Not to worry about subject area. The forum has some flexibility.

Welcome to track making. I'm sure we'll get you some feedback before too long.

Hey Ash, how ya doing partner? I'll have a look-see tonight and have you a few pics/comments no later than tomorrow morning, bud. Oh and hey - good to see ya in here.

hehe, ive been in here before, it took me ages to find my password back. Then i suddenly remember i used the wrong username lmao. Its great to make tracks, I've been away from the game lately but im getting addicted again :p

Friendly greetz to all off you!!
Ashes

Nice to meet you Ashes.

Great track! lil' rough in some areas, but I like that sometimes.

I only have a couple major issues with it so far, and that is the bridge before Checkpoint 2. You need to extend the bridge toward the take-off ramp some. I run Pro, and after 4 laps, I only cleared it once. The Rookie guys will never make that, as it is now.
Or it needs to be smoothed out before that turn towards the jump, so people can get more of a run at it. You just come up shy by a few feet.

There is another problem spot, but that may be my fault, I just need to pick the right line to get over it smoothly.

It could also use the sun set up higher in it, it's kinda dark to me.

But other than that, I think it's an excellent start. It's fast, and I love the layout. This should turn out to be one kick booty track when it's all said and done.

Nice to meet you to Rep Fan. I will need a little help here..the sun..huh? can you set the sun? hehe and how? I worked on that bridge before cp2 and im not gonna change it again, im not gonna higher the jump before. Im gonna flatten the road to the jump a bit more thnx for the comment.

Oh yea, you have a lot of control over the lighting.



http://cownap.com/~mtmg/traxx/lighting.html

Got about 25 pic taken for ya, Ash - will post em up after I get home from work tomorrow.

Ok here we go, and I'll start with the texture first:

To begin with, on future projects, consider getting the terrain hammered out and perfected as much as possible first, then move on to the model work. I believe that's how the high-profile track makers do it, and if not, I'm sure they'll correct me.

• Alrighty, here are a few shots of blending flaws that are consistent throughout the track:

1 2 3 4 5 6 7

• And here are a few shots of the multitude of alignment flaws throughout:

1 2 3

The map - there are a few extra lines in there that make it cumbersome, somewhat difficult to follow in certain areas. Here's a shot of the entire layout. The red dots indicate roadway that I think could come out since they serve no practical purpose. If that line of reasoning doesn't work, possibly think in terms of "added value". If something in your track doesn't "add value", it might be worthwhile to remove it or alter it.

-------------------------------

• How about losing this groundbox and insert an actual bridge model. The problem with groundboxes is they inevitably cause you to stick on the landings. Not every time, mind you, but the point is you shouldn't stick, and there's an easy solution, which is using a model.

• I noticed you chose to use what I refer to as "old style" trees. Have a look at some of HotShoe's tracks (Crabtree Lake, SLO Construction, The Grade). He's got some dang nice trees, and I think they really help to bring out the visual quality of a track.

• That jump to the bridge (which is also a groundbox that deserves to be subbed out for a model) is makeable in rookie mode. You have to set it at 1900/2000 to make it, but that's ok. Heck in rookie mode your top speed is only about 82 mph anyway, so you can drive just about every track out here in rookie at 1900 or 2000 and fair quite well. However, it is tough, and sticking a very small invisible platform in there to help those who fall short may be something to consider. And mind you I'm talking very small. In rookie mode you should be able to at least get the front tires on the bridge, so you wouldn't need much help. As for the pro's, if you can't make that jump, maybe rumbling is more your speed...or checkers lolol. RF is gonna be *beep* now lol.

• Here are two spots where I think signs could be installed indicating that the road is closed off. Actually, that entire road could be taken out altogther in my opinion. here & here.

• Since this is somewhat of a major undertaking, I haven't intentionally went thru it looking for shorts. My first impression, however, is you've made pretty good use of terrian & water to negate slicers and dicers, but the path to checkpoint 4 can be altered as shown here. I'm not so sure it's faster, but I'd venture to say it would allow a racer to potentially gain an edge with respect to positioning given the roughness of the terrain as you round the corner to checkpoint 4 going the traditional route.

• Here's an example of a few severe peaks I found throughout the track. Rounding them off gives the overall look a more natural look and feel.

• In the air base section my opinion is that you've got a lot of redundancy (as shown here) with respect to your models. Consider throwing in some more variety (and the models are out there, too). If it gets to a point where lag may be an issue on lower end machines, you can always set some of the models to complex.

• Here are several spots (1 - 2 - 3) that are bland. Again, something as simple as a few nice, well-placed trees can do wonders

• Speaking of trees, you've got the cluster thing working overtime here, Ash lol. Looks like a convention down there. Break that stuff up, man and spread those suckers around! I think you got enough there to help fill in some of the aforementioned bland areas.

• This spot here should be rounded it off, I think. If one of your tires happens to come off that sharp ledge, you're toast. Plus, I just think it looks more natural and realistic if the roadway is free of acute edges of that sort.


That's it for now. I'll keep lookin, and report whatever I find.

I only said what I said about the bridge, because you have to make track that EVERYONE can run, no matter what the skill level.

After my post, I went back and ran it again, and geared down to 1100 or 1200, and I made it everytime. First time I had it on 1500.

I'd also try to smooth out the corners of the hills, there are some sharp ones there that'll grab you in some spots, and send your truck skyward.

And btw Rumble Girl, I'd kick your tail in Checkers anyway.

LOL that's my point; that jump is makeable in every skill level, especially pro. Recall I wasn't the one up in here going "I...I...I can't make that jump on the bridge most times. I come up short and...and...and then I fall down. Waaaaaaaaah" lolol. And I would hope you could kick my butt in checkers cuz driving isn't your strong suite lol. It's ok though, RF. From here on in just stand off on the side of the road with your cotton candy, yo-yo, and tricycle and let the ppl who know how to drive do their thing lol.

Ashes,

First, let me say this is an improvement over your first release. Second, as cope pointed out there is still much to be done. And third, though by the time we're done it will look like we've pretty much lambasted your track, please understand we are by no means trying to be critical, but rather trying to point out things so that you can turn it up a notch and make this a track that everybody will enjoying racing. The trouble with that, of course, is that inevitably some things are matters of personal preference, some are strictly cosmetic, while other issues are more of a technical nature. A case in point might be the jump to cp2. Cope makes claims he has no trouble, RF has made adjustments, but to me it's still just a tad on the long side. As a track maker this is something you'll eventually have to make some decisions on, and then we'll have to live with the outcome. The purpose of beta testing, in the way we do it here, is just to make you aware of things so that informed choices can be made.

Another thing of concern, and ultimately what slowed down my response, is this is a big track. There's lots going on, and knowing what to focus on and what not to can sometimes be hard. Nobody wants to find a hundred flaws in a track, but, at the same time, nobody wants to leave anything unattended. I'm not going to suggest you should start with shorter tracks, since you're obviously capable of much more, but rather please take all this in stride. As you learn, the task will get much easier. It does, I assure you.

Now, on to the goodies. Cope's given you lots to think about so I'll restrict my feedback, on this round, to just a few items.

• The map. Main course. Look between course segment 22 and 23. There's one between numbered 33. Delete it and insert one at the end of 22. (hover the mouse over the end so you see the red ball, then right click). All the segments should ruffle up to the proper sequence numbers. Then regenerate courses one and two from the main. That 'should' take care of the in game map oddity. Any trouble or questions, please just ask.


Related to the map are visuals and the race line.

• <a href="http://cownap.com/~forum/beta/hiddenairbase/Image1.jpg">pic</a>. In this location, the texture color, brightest, and sun position conspire to hide the direction of the course. One is tempted to continue straight whereas the course veers to the right. And even after a couple laps and you know it turns right, the road is not in clear sight. Options include light settings, banking the corner, or painting the far right mound, just past the road, with dirt textures. All these things provide visual markers to help the racer navigate the course.

• <a href="http://cownap.com/~forum/beta/hiddenairbase/Image2.jpg">pic</a>. Here we have a similar situation. In fact, it's just after the above turn. Things you can do here to let the racer know the road does not continue straight are placing an extra tree or two directly ahead of the road or perhaps build up a hill that obstructs the path. The hill could also be painted with dirt patches.

• <a href="http://cownap.com/~forum/beta/hiddenairbase/Image3.jpg">pic</a>. In the last case, the water pretty much lets us know we're not to continue in a straight line, but the opening to the left is anything but clear. Again, solutions could include adjustments to the light settings and probably painting some dirt patches in there.

Being able to turn the map off in order to navigate the course goes a long way to making a track more enjoyable. Making the race line easily visible helps to this end.


Left over biz.

The disadvantage of using one model dozens of times means it looks repetitive. The advantage is less texture load in memory and more efficient rendering. In most issues there are trade offs. Striking the balance between the two is the knack.


Hope this helps.

I changed most of the wrong textures you showed Cope, i found the map default and it shows ok now, i rounded some more tops, and I gave taken care of bland areas. I can remove some models as they are duplicatred too much, and I have downloaded some bridges and extra models but I always get an error, dunno what to do with this... I set the sun higher and must say that was a good remark, tha difference looks real awesome. Thanks for the great comment and tips. When this track will be finished, its not gonna be "very" good. But I'm gonna have these tips and use thse in a next track. So far I have changed everything you mentioned except the extra models (bridges).

Thanks,
Ashes

ps, can I put the beta2 link in here?

> can I put the beta2 link in here?

Sure.

Here it is: http://www.freehen.raiderhosting.us/ash ... _Beta2.zip

Ashes

NIRBBRD2.RAW (for the billboard) is all black ?

[ edit 1 ]

uh oh, you lost the file extension for all your models. I suspect this is going to cause you no small problem as you'll probably have to place all your models in the track all over again.

http://cownap.com/~mtmg/errors/lnth.html
http://cownap.com/~mtmg/folderoptions.shtml

[ edit 2 ]

I just checked cliff road and it's the same thing. It's a small miracle either of these runs at all.

can't he just uncheck that 'hide extensions' box ?

Otherwise it would be a bummer. He told me last night that he lost all his models. I knew what the problem was but i could not help him because he had to go.

If he has to place them all over again, it sure does s*ck.

This is the best I can offer.

http://mtm2.com/~mtmg/traxx/modelbox.shtml

In the past, anybody who runs into the problem has had to delete all the models and start again.

So you dont see that billboard?

Because I co see that billboard and its colours. I would like to ask it some1 if they see the objects. I thought those .raw error would give troubles someday